Silvia Club of NSW

How bad is this? I sometimes am really glad that I am not in the states. I wonder how loose they are with their gun licence and how u obtain a gun too. It seems like we hear school shooting so much from there. We had the tas shooting but thats about it I think. I feel sorry for the familys that have to suffer and go through the hard times.

glad i dont live in Tasmania...

Martin Bryant did 35. We are still higher than the states...

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Yeah thats true, but still the number of times it has happened in the school. It seems so easy to buy a gun in the states. All u need is green slip or to say u are a perm in the states and no felony record u can buy a glock for $684 apparently thats what the newspaper said anyways.

yeh but population wise we have more shootings then the usa, group buy on kevlar vests!

oh.. its 32 frags for the US, 33 if u include the shooter who took his own life. Martin did 35 frags and with an IQ of 66, he wasnt smart enough to take his own life. technically, they are still behind by 3...

All the signs were all there and psyhcological help was offered but he refused...

For once, i can say Good onya howard for the semi+automatic guns policy...

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because I can see how you put those two points together.

the guy needed psychological help,and refused to be treated,so because of that,lawful firearm ownership in another country should be outlawed? wake up to yourself!

that's like saying that cricket bats should be banned here because a guy who was upset in sri lanka went out and bought one,and then beat someone up with it.

how far do you want to go? how about knives too? they CAN kill people IF they're USED INCORRECTLY BY THE PERSON HOLDING THEM.
should we ALL be eating with plastic cutlery because some wanker stabbed someone in a nightclub once?


we already have pretty restrictive firearm laws in this country,and are nothing like the US.
it's practically impossible to obtain a concealed carry permit in Australia,ownership for personal defense is not allowed,and sporting shooters are put through a very stringent probation period,and are limited in the type of firearms they can purchase,once they've completed a 3month safety course,completed over a full year's membership of a registered gun club,and have had a police background check done on them,and have asked in writing three months prior to buying a firearm for permission to do so from the police.
you can aslo lose your license at any time if you fail to comply with any of the regulations. that includes something like stopping for a coke at a servo while on your way home from a range with the firearm secured in a locked case in the boot of your locked car. you are required to go directly from where you store the firearm to the range and back. you can't even stop to take a piss on the way.
how restrictive do things have to be?

we still have plenty of shootings in Australia,but how many of them are by registered shooters,using lawfully obtained firearms,and how many of them are carried out by criminals using stolen police and military weapons,or other firearms obtained illegally?
if you have enough cash,you can buy anything in the cross. $3k gets you an illegal glock. hell,I got offered an UZI once. that sure as hell wasn't a legal firearm.

the americans are SO far ahead of australia when it comes to shootings,I doubt that even our current population would equal how many people have been killed over there in various gun crimes throughout their history.

firearm ownership IS too loose in the US,even I'll agree with that.

people are also to quick in this country to use tragedies like this to further their own political ends.
the greens are jumping up and down wanting handguns banned totally, finishing off the already heavy restrictions we have on them. they banned semi-automatic rifles back in '96,so they've already won that part.
the nut in virginia wasn't using a bolt action,so we can't stretch things all the way over here and take them away from Australian hunters,farmers,and gun club members as well just yet...

the greens want gun ownership outlawed. some of you say that's fine,as you don't shoot one,and aren't interested in them,so it won't affect you.
if it was a guy who ran over a heap of people in a corvette,and they now wanted powerful cars outlawed,you'd be outraged I'm sure.
what makes your hobby more important than someone elses? if it's legal,and they follow the rules,what harm is there?

the greens also got marjiuana de-criminalised,and they now want meth-amphetamine to be de-criminalised. yeah,it should be legal to posess ice according to them.

then there's the councillor in waverley who wants cars banned from the city. she feels they're un-necessary,and that everyone should ride push bikes,like she does. that's normal.... I can see my girlfriend riding a mountain bike from bondi to chatswood and back each day... makes perfect sense to me...

we also had a serial paedophile released from long bay Gaol yesterday, and three convicted gang rapists only got 18mths gaol for their crimes,and all of that is fine too according to the greens,but because some guy over in the US lost it after refusing mental care and shot a group of people,Australians should be penalised.
yeah,makes plenty of sense to me,I'll SO be voting for them in the next election....


Justin...

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STI - Made in Texas,not Japan.

^^^ I totally agree.
It makes me sick to think that someone who has sexually assulted a young boy or girl can walk free in the public again. They should be shot. The amount of scaring they would have done to the poor innocent victims, they have to rebuild their lives, gain trust in people again, feel safe whenever they are alone, years and years of nightmares. Just cos some fuckwit wanted to get his dick wet. I hope they all rot in hell.
There was a story on the news yesterday about a young mother who had her babies inside the house, took out her rubbish into the garage and was raped in her own garage. What the fuck? If people who have to be as desperate as to rape people or put pills in peoples drinks they may as well kill themselves now and save everyone a lot of hassle, and save our tax paying money when they get put in jail. Then they will know what it feels like to be somebody elses bitch.

Restrictions are in place to stop a more vast majority of people being able to obtain such things much easier... and sure there will always be places you can obtain anything illegally, but without any restrictions what so ever, the results stand favourably to be much more chaotic as these potential threats become readily available for anyone who wishes to attain them. Not everyone may agree on this fact, but it's like this no matter where you are.. social factors and provinces we reside in may decipher the difference between the mindsets of many as well as the overlaying incompitence of a few which can aid in the creation of some catastrophic problems within a small or large community depending on what some fuckwits intentions are... Though of course, no matter how much you ban things or try to make it so hard to get, there will always be another way to attain it, but i'd much rather prefer to have restrictions in place and make things like this so much harder to attain fo the every day joe, than have things like a 'weapon' shop at the end of every other block with the option to allow anyone to come in and purchase these weapons at their own leasure..

I don't trust strangers near my car when it's unlocked, let alone trusting them to be able to own a firearm or any other weapon legally...

Fucked up shit happens everywhere in the world, and what can we do to stop it? if you got an answer that will work, then please go run for government.. but as far as whinging and complaining about things the authorities are trying to do in order to prevent or decrease these statistics from happening around us goes, fuck off and get a clue why don't ya.. sure some things that certain electorates may endorse may be retarded ideas which seem absolutely pointless, and yes.. we all notice this.. altough the ones which are agreed upon by a majority with sufficient evidence backing their claims, to help make things safer... shit, i'd rather stick with the "Less Death" rather than the "I trust this random hick with a potentially lethal weapon around my kids" theory..

My Two Cents .....

- Mat

Guns laws in the USA.

http://www.soros.org/initiatives/justic ... Report.pdf


The American constitution states you are allowed to keep and bear arms.

18 years old and a computer back ground check from a registered gun dealer and you may buy..Easy as going to Liqour land. Private dealers-well you can get anything you want.

Americas just fucked for making it so easy. 85 Gun related deaths daily..
Wheres the problem still?

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Whoaa!

noone's saying to remove current restrictions. I agree with what we currently have in place. I don't see any need for things to be stricter however.
especially if the impetus for such is a regrettable event in another country that has nothing to do with us.
you can't buy a firearm at k-mart here,and you can't carry one for personal defense. citing how things are in the US is irrelevant here,as the situation in this country is completely different.

if you do own a firearm legally,and don't follow the rules,you lose it instantly,and if you break the rules badly enough,you go to gaol. noone leaves their pistol loaded under their pillow 'just in case' here. quite the opposite. they're locked away in a safe that's been inspected and approved by the police,and is randomly re-inspected for as long as you posess a firearm. the firearm is disabled whilst locked away,and ammunition is kept separate from it,in another locked storage device.
is that safe enough for you?

if you want to talk less death,then let's just ban cars. the statistics prove that the 'average hick' as you put it can't be trusted with a motor vehicle,as hundreds of Australians die on the roads every year. why aren't we restricting car ownership in the same fashion as people are wanting firearms to be restricted?
driver's licenses are far too easy to obtain here. if you can drive through a westfield car park without crashing,you can have a license. that doesn't even scratch the surface when it comes to controlling a motor vehicle properly,but it's all that's required.

licensed firearm owners in this country are far from casual with handling their firearms.
noone carries one on their person on the street. this isn't the wild west of the US.
they're far more careful with their handling than how your average P plater is with a motor vehicle from what I see on the roads. I've never seen a pistol shooter wave a pistol around in an un-safe manner whilst on a range,but I see plenty of P platers driving what can also be seen as a lethal weapon acting like complete tools. one great example that springs to mind was about a month ago when,funnily enough I was on my way to the shooting range one night. three carloads of young guys,all of them on their P's were weaving through the peak hour traffic on parramatta road. when they could stay alongside each other for a bit in croydon,the driver of one car and the passenger of the one alongside decided to play handsies whilst driving in traffic. high fives,slaps,and what may as well have been secret handshakes. yeah,that's perfectly safe and understandable behaviour...

restricting legal ownership of firearms will NOT prevent criminals using ones they obtain illegally. this has been proven time and time again all over the world.
people who jump through the hoops to legally obtain a firearm do everything they can to make sure they retain their privilege to posess it.
punishing people who follow the rules is absurd.


Justin...

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STI - Made in Texas,not Japan.

i wasn't saying to further restrict the current laws upon gun ownership, was simply just stating that those sorta things had been implimented for a reason, and i realllly do agree with you about how sad the current licensing situation is.. i think it would be a pretty good estimation that if EVERY SINGLE PERSON who owned a license had to resit their exams being both theoretical + practical, we'd have a hell of a lot less drivers on the roads now days.. actually forget theoretical test, just the practical even, we'd cut down on soooo many... this is how we fix all of our future traffic congestion problems .. get rid of the shitty drivers thus making our roads emptier for those of us who aren't licensed lunatics controlling a 2 tonne metallic combination travelling in excess of 60-100km/h around our quiet streets and (even though they can barely control the car when its doing between 30-40km/h properly...)

Do you even trust the other drivers on the road? i sure as hell don't.. and really don't know anyone who actually does...

*shrugs* a lot of things are real messed up within the system today, whether it be insane restrictions or laws that make no sense, but that being said.. i guess we all know where to draw the line between safe precautions and going over the edge because of an over-reaction from a foreign or freak event...

IMO at the end of the day if some head case wants to get a gun and shoot all of his class mates, he will. Restrictions or no restrictions he will still be able to obtain a gun from somewhere. Just like the restrictions with P plate drivers, if they want to get into a car and go fast, they can. Just might take a little bit longer to get to 160km's and over. My car before my current was a AE93 Corolla, and on an empty highway it pushed 195km's out of a 1.6ltr inline 4cyl. The best chance we have is to educate, not restrict everyone so they get a fine if they scratch their own ass.

My point on it- is that ITS SO EASY to obtain a gun there- that in a likey event of you being in depression hole, and you have rage, you have hate, you have anger built up inside- that ANYONE can just snap and get all Trigger happy because of the EASE in which a firearm can be obtained.
Yes this guy was alot more premeditated in his executions, but this happens daily there - which tells you something dont it.

Allowing nearly any person to carry a hand gun in society. Thats a disaster waiting to happen... and it does..

Its such BIG business that it will never change there anyway.

Why does anyone need a gun for anyway? referring to Suburban living areas?) (besides pest control, storage, recreational)
For Protection? - if thats the mentality- then this shit happens.
The US constitution sucks ass- and it DOES NOT protect the people.

In terms of poor drivers- thast a seperate issue. Weekend drivers suck ass. Id love to shoot all them shit drivers (no driving ettiqute)- but I cant cos it too hard to get a gun.. Maybe Ill move to the US. and thats my point.

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Whoaa!

yeap, shootings by people with registered and legal firearms is unheard of, its all the illegally obtained ones that are a problem.

as for how hard it is, yes virginia makes it all too easy. no waiting list, no background check, no licence.

waiting list should be a requirement, as with background check

HOLY CRAP, theres some good conversation going on in this thread. Good to see everyone putting down their opinion and points very well!

Guess i shouldnt add what some guys at work said about this situation then....

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Pro Concept = Where all my fuckups get fixed!!